Live Pterosaur - Part 37

December 20, 2014

Jonathan Whitcomb Interviewed by Dave Scott (Podcast Radio)

The Spaced Out Radio Show featured Dave Scott interviewing me, for two hours on the night of December 18, 2014, Pacific Standard Time, in a podcast called “Pterodactyls exist in 2014?” The following is part of the beginning of that interview.

Dave Scott:

. . . every now and again you get these topics . . . that just excite you. It’s this one for me. . . . Dinosaurs were said to have gone extinct 50, 60 million years ago. . . . however, what if, and just what if—think of the possibilities—what if not all of them are extinct?

Take the pterodactyl. People between the United States—right now—towards South America, over in New Guinea believe that the pterodactyl is still alive and that they are breeding. There might not be a lot of sightings of them, but people say they exist. Scientists will tell us something different . . . “Nope; they’re gone; they’re done . . .” but people are still seeing them.

This is why tonight we’ve brought Jonathan Whitcomb aboard. He’s a cryptozoologist and he’s on the hunt for the pterodactyl. Jonathan, welcome to Spaced Out Radio; how are you this evening?

Jonathan Whitcomb:

Oh, great, Dave. I’m so delighted to be here with you!

Scott:

And we’re delighted to have you as well. OK, I’m going to hit you with the million-dollar question, right off the bat: Are pterodactyls alive in 2014?

Whitcomb:

Yes, they are alive indeed. In fact, my associates and I believe there are more than one species in different parts of the world. It’s incredible but we’ll get into that: explain how that happened. Yeah, they are alive.

Scott:

That just amazes me that they are so hidden and yet regular science does not believe that they are alive; but I suggest that’s why there [are] cryptozoologists, like yourself, out there who are experienced in looking for this type of animal.

Whitcomb:

Yeah. I guess, to begin with, we should mention that a definition in the dictionary always includes the word extinct, so no matter what dictionary you use you’ll always find the word extinct, so technically, if we’re going by the dictionary, you know, we can’t do anything, but what we’re seeing here is that actually the creatures that are known commonly as pterodactyls and officially known by scientists as pterosaurs, that they actually do have representation in modern times . . .

The problem with discovery is multiple: They’re mostly nocturnal and the Western scientists have just assumed they’re all extinct. Well, the fact is that apparently a number of the types that we know from fossils are, unfortunately, . . . extinct, we have a very narrow band of types of pterosaurs . . . with particular types now, with particular types of head crests. So basically, in the general sense, yeah, pterosaurs . . . are extinct, but there are certain narrow ranges of species that are still alive.

From one who listened to this podcast:

. . . Jonathan David Whitcomb, did an incredible interview last night on his research concerning living pterodactyls. It’s awesome to think that the world is so much bigger than we think and that there are more discoveries to be made!

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Jonathan Whitcomb videos on YouTube

In 1944, in (Papua) New Guinea, Duane Hodgkinson and his friend saw a “pterodactyl” with a wingspan similar to a Piper Tri-Pacer (29 feet).

Honesty and reports of modern pterosaurs

Within the past few weeks, three web sites have caught my attention, each with a page accusing me of dishonesty. Two of them appear to be based on the other . . .

Weirdness and Whitcomb’s book on live pterosaurs

. . . as a child I was rather obsessed with dinosaurs, as many young boys are, and read everything I could find on them, and I thought I knew about Pterodactyls, Pteradnodons and a few others like the Rhamphorhyncus. So I recalled they were all Pterosaurs, and looked up the Order. First surprise is technically they were not dinosaurs at all . . . I wanted to read about people who had been chased by pterodactyls! . . . then suddenly found that there actually was a “Living Pterosaur” research community, a fringe even within cryptozoology.

Podcast-Radio Interview in 2012

We first had fossils that were discovered in Western science . . . in 1780’s . . . about the time that George Washington became president. . . . Since then, scientists have continuously discovered new fossils . . . delicate kind of bones, so a lot of times they’re just crushed . . .

December 16, 2014January 19, 2015

Pterodactyl Attacks in Yosemite?

Eskin Kuhn drew this sketch one of the two pterosaurs he saw flying in Cuba

I’m only about half through reading the nonfiction book Missing 411 Western United States & Canada, by David Paulides, as I compile information that might tie some of the cases to a large flying predator. I still need to finish this book and then analyze the data from these many reports of persons who go missing in the USA and Canada; but from what I have seen so far, I see what is probably responsible for some disappearances.

Strange Missing Persons Cases in North America

These weird disappearances are not confined to Yosemite, nor even to the United States. Several factors do seem to tie together cases that are separated by long distances and sometimes separated by decades. To understand what may be happening in Yosemite National Park, we need to see in a broader sense. Look to Canada and to Mexico.

People see large flying creatures in North America, featherless animals that appear more like “pterodactyls” than like any bird or bat known to science. A small portion of these reports at least suggest that a few of these creatures will sometimes attack a human. Much of the evidence may be circumstantial, but it appears that attacks take place in Northern Mexico and in northern British Columbia, Canada. Why should the territories between those countries be any different? Why should Americans in wilderness areas be immune?

The Sherlock Holmes Approach

When the impossible has been eliminated, whatever is left is the answer. I’m paraphrasing Sherlock Holmes, but here’s the point: What is left? Consider the following:

Many persons go missing in or near national parks in the United States. David Paulides has researched many cases and is convinced many more of them exist. What do most of these appear to have in common? People disappear in or near a wilderness.

From I can tell so far, from reading his book, most persons in these cases are never found, alive or dead. When a person or a body is found, it is often miles away and where that person or body should not have been found. It’s often at a much higher elevation, even on or near a mountain peak or ridge or it’s a body at the base of a cliff.

What bear, Grizzly or Black, would catch a human and then drag him or her up a cliff or steep mountainside? Winter cases eliminate bears right away, for they hibernate; but even in summer a bear would not try to drag a person miles away, up to a higher elevation, even thousands of feet higher and then remove clothing before eating. There’s more against a bear interpretation, but that will do for now: Those animals are not responsible for these weird cases of missing persons.

What mountain lion would drag a man or woman up into the mountains for miles, even to thousands of feet higher than the catching location? And why would a mountain lion remove one or both shoes and possibly some other clothing and then leave the human’s body uneaten high up on a mountain? Any cougar foolish enough to attack a human would not take that person, dead or alive, far away just for stealing clothing. There is no such cougar.

What about a animalistic human predator? Could not a sexual predator remove a victim’s clothing? That could happen, but many of these disappearances cannot reasonably be applied to human criminal activity. Sexual predators do not usually subdue a human victim for the purpose of dragging that person for miles over mountainous terrain, to elevations of up to 3,000 feet or more than where the victim was captured. And why exert such a super-human effort when a snow storm is beginning to make such a long wilderness journey almost impossible, even without a victim to drag along? And consider this: How would a human predator pull an adult man up a sheer cliff many hundreds of feet high? If Superman had fallen into the depravity of kidnapping people to carry them up into wilderness areas, for decades, to steal one or two shoes or sometimes other clothing, he would have found it too tiring to continue that perverse activity for many decades. No. Human criminals have not been involved in many of these cases.

What about a Bigfoot? I suggest that such a large mammal would have a larger brain than that of an amoeba. Even an earthworm can use good judgment in deciding whether or not to ascend. Why would a Bigfoot choose a time right before the coming of a storm to kidnap a human and then carry that person far up into the mountains, to a much higher elevation, sometimes as a snow storm is beginning? Those weather conditions are common with many of these strange missing persons cases, but that can appear baffling to investigators and search-and-rescue people.

Pterosaur Attack Possibilities

If ropens or some other unclassified flying creatures have been responsible for many of these attacks, what about the weather? Think of it this way: When would a very hungry ropen be most likely to attack a human? Maybe right before a cold storm, for starvation may result without some kind of food. If such a flying creature had some sense of a coming storm (the lowering air pressure perhaps), its fear of humans could be overcome by hunger. That would explain why so many persons go missing right before a storm.

Why is a variety of clothing missing from living persons and bodies that have been found? Sometimes the clothing is found far from where the person or body is found. A large flying creature that tries to carry away an adult or child—that animal will often grab hold of clothing, eventually allowing the person to fall out of that clothing. If a ropen had the best hold on one or both shoes, that would remain in the creature’s grip. If the pants were what the animal best held onto, they might turn inside out as the human fell out of the trousers. That is why pants are sometimes found inside out.

Sometimes the creature might return to where it had been flying and find the body of the human on the ground but sometimes not. One of these cases we can now consider:

Kenny Miller, north of Yosemite

I hope that knowledge of this case may help save at least one human life in the future.

Although the disappearance of this child was 22 years ago, I offer my condolences to the family. Such a tragedy is hard to live with, and the mysterious nature of the twelve-year-old’s death does not make it easier. I have only some of the information on what happened, so I admit that other details may suggest some explanation other than what I here offer; but this is the best that I can do for now in providing one possible answer.

What happened to Kenny? Why was his body found far above where he had disappeared? No bear or mountain lion would drag the boy so far and leave him intact, high up on a mountain ridge, at an elevation 1400 feet higher. And why did so few of his clothes remain, just a T-shirt and cotton shorts according to the author David Paulides? If none of the additional facts disagree, the following explanation appears to me mostly likely:

One large ropen, or other unclassified flying creature, carried away the boy. The animal was trying to reach its cave or hiding location but the child kept falling out of the clothing and shoes. Eventually the creature lost track of where the boy had fallen or it assumed that he had fallen off the mountain. The falls may have been at just a short height above ground with limited, if any, injury to the boy. Why? The creature would have little reason to fly far above the ground with a heavy load, for that would require more energy. It eventually was able to reach a higher elevation but still without any need to ever be far above the ground. That would explain the cause of death that was given in the book: exposure.

I hope that this particular ropen then became discouraged from ever again attacking people in this area of California, but other creatures may have continued similar attacks. We need eyewitnesses to come forward and report any attack by a large flying creature, whether the attack was carried through or was aborted before the person was grabbed.

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Pterodactyl Attacks and Human Deaths

I hope that no pterosaur was responsible for any of the human deaths in British Columbia, Canada, along the 500-mile stretch of highway from Prince George to Prince Rupert . . . we now face a present danger, a warning from Gerald McIsaac, author of Bird From Hell, who believes that “most of the hitchhikers [on this highway at night] who disappear have been killed by this animal. It is also my opinion that many of the people who have disappeared have not been reported.”

Missing Persons in Western USA

Those who know about eyewitness reports of ropens need little persuasion to be careful in open areas of wilderness. The automobiles of both Mayo and Tolhurst were found at or near the Donnell Vista, an open area overlooking a lake. Especially do not allow children to ever be alone in such an open area above a body of water. In addition, adults should be aware of anything that might be flying overhead.

Attacks From a Ropen in New Mexico?

A speculation can fail, under scrutiny, but when human lives are in danger we need action. I’ve recently been reading the nonfiction Missing 411 – Western United States & Canada, by the former lawman David Paulides. On page 200, the author points out that all six of those missing persons listed in New Mexico disappeared in the Santa Fe National Forest.

Pterosaurs Reported in the Southwest Pacific

There have also been reports of attacks: large or giant flying creatures attacking natives in Papua New Guinea. Some of the encounters have caused human deaths, in particular on the mainland west of Finschhafen.

Nonfiction Searching for Ropens and Finding God paperback by J. D. Whitcomb

From the back cover of this astonishing book:

A handful of Americans have explored remote jungles in Papua New Guinea, searching for living pterosaurs, called by most Americans “pterodactyls.” . . . This resulted in the publication of several books, two scientific papers in a peer-reviewed journal, and over a thousand blog posts . . .

December 11, 2014December 12, 2014

“Stupid Dinosaur Lies” or Truth?

Australia and Papua New Guinea stamps on passport for Jonathan Whitcomb

Within the past few weeks, at least two posts have accused me, Jonathan Whitcomb, of deceiving people. The second writer, “idoubtit,” seems to have been convinced by the first one, Dr. Donald Prothero, regarding my online writing behavior. But when Prothero responded to me, he appeared to reveal two sources for his conviction that I have used deception, and the earliest source is the site Stupid Dinosaur Lies, more recently relabeled “PaleoFairy Tales Exposed.” Let’s look into this more deeply.

The oldest online attack against the honesty of cryptozoologists who publicized their belief in living pterosaurs in Papua New Guinea—that site may have originated as early as mid-2005 or as late as late-2008; I don’t recall. I do remember, and recorded in my file, one original page on Stupid Dinosaur Lies, and it had at least five errors in one sentence:

Misspelling of my first name: “John” (should have been Jonathan)
Misspelling of my surname: “Whittcomb” (should have been Whitcomb)
Was I really sponsored by Carl Baugh? No.
Did I really lead YEC creationists on an expedition? No.
Was the expedition really in Africa? No.

That’s a lot of mistakes in one sentence, those errors of fact, and the truth can be verified. I do not imply that this sentence remained on that site for years, but it was similar to other declarations on the original site: full of errors. I have no interest, at least for the moment, in reading recent pages of that site. If the writer has recognized those errors and admitted them, then good for him (or her).

Let me make this plain: I am not accusing the originator of Stupid Dinosaur Lies of deception. I am defending the honesty of me and my associates. That ludicrous sentence with five errors does suggest the writer was more likely to have been careless than dishonest. But the accusations, direct or indirect, are against those of us who have traveled to Papua New Guinea to search for living pterosaurs and those who later reported what was found in eyewitness testimonies.

Whitcomb-Paina Expedition of 2004

I recognize that writers sometimes make mistakes with errors of fact; I myself am a writer, and the first edition of my first book included the misspelling of the surname of my interpreter on Umboi Island (correct is Paina). What you are now reading was published on December 11, 2014, but I made corrections 24 hours later, correcting errors in both English grammar and in statements of fact (“September 22nd” is correct for my arrival date in Papua New Guinea in 2004, as you will read below).

So why do I bring up one sentence written by a skeptic years ago? It’s in the nature of his accusation and the relevance to my expedition ten years ago. The error is far deeper than that one sentence with five mistakes.

Let’s begin by establishing that I really did travel to Papua New Guinea.

Passport page (Jonathan David Whitcomb) for Australia and Papua New Guinea

The following is to the best of my knowledge of what happened ten years ago.

The above image of a page in my passport shows a departure date from Australia: September 21, 2004. We boarded the plane in Cairns, AU, on that date, but we had to get off the plane before it took off, for the pilot was unhappy with a problem with the paperwork for the flight or paperwork for the plane. Although he had no doubt that the plane was safe, he went by the book and refused to fly it until the paperwork was corrected. We, the passengers, were taken off the plane and got a free night in a hotel in Cairns. We took off without further incident the next day, September 22nd. That explains the date of arrival in Papua New Guinea (it was a short flight).

Honesty of Jonathan Whitcomb, in the past

The critical point is this: Skeptics who wrote online comments and pages that at least implied that I was less than honesty—those critics failed to see the landscape of the forest, instead focusing on a stain on the bark of one tree, a stain they assumed must be bird poop . . . so to speak.

I returned home to the United States convinced that the ropen is real and a modern Rhamphorhynchoid pterosaur (I am still convinced of that). I wrote countless web pages and blog posts on the subject, which probably relates to why that skeptic created his own site: Stupid Dinosaur Lies.

Yet he probably failed to see a simple problem with his proclamations about dishonesty: I returned home to the United States declaring that I had seen nothing like a living pterosaur. I even failed to see the brief light that natives of Umboi Island have observed flying at night for so long.

Now please consider the problem with a “lie” accusation here:

Jonathan Whitcomb writes about the possibility of modern pterosaurs
He never saw anything like a living pterosaur on his expedition

Remember, this is not about my foolishness, which is irrelevant here; it’s about my honesty. If I had any desire to deceive anybody into believing in extant pterosaurs, I would have declared I had seen something flying over my head. I admitted that I had seen no animal that supported my belief. Therefore I was honest.

Honesty in the present

So how can my accusers respond to the above? Have I somehow become dishonest at some time in the past ten years? Do a Google search on “apparent pterosaur” (using those quote marks) and see what comes up: not many pages from skeptics who dispute the possibility that any pterosaur can be still living; most of the pages were written by me, with some of them obviously being written years ago and some of them more recently. In other words, my posts and pages dominate all others, when one searches online with “apparent pterosaur,” and that means the following:

I admit: a particular sighting may have come from something other than a pterosaur.

Does that look like a declaration of a liar who wants to deceive people into believing in modern pterosaurs? The point of modern pterosaurs is in the overall landscape of eyewitness testimonies: Many of them (not all) are from encounters with modern living pterosaurs, including large Rhamphorhynchoid ones.

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Honesty in Reports of Modern Pterosaurs

The word deceive means to purposefully lead someone away from the truth. A word associated with it is lie: to say or write something deceitful. . . . A deceiver intends to lead someone away from truth; intention is a critical ingredient of the poison. Nobody can accidentally deceive anyone.

Dr. Prothero and “Fake Pterosaurs”

I avoid linking to libelous pages, and this one includes “Whitcomb admitted the deception in July, 2014″ and links to one of my posts. Strange to tell, but that post of mine explains why I was NOT being dishonest in using pen names.

The Great Dinosaur Mystery and the Big Truth

This same critic says that sightings are “made by natives . . . plagued by superstition,” but where is the evidence of any plague of superstition? . . . My own experience in Papua New Guinea has shown that this is not the case. Whatever superstitions the natives of Umboi have, they are not mentioned or implied when native eyewitnesses report what they have seen (almost without exception). This critic has explored what remote island, interviewed what native? Has this critic even read an original eyewitness report? If so, where is the evidence for relevant superstition?

Bulverism Revisited

An average reader who gets very far on that [libelous] site is unlikely to search out the actual words and deeds of living-pterosaur investigators. Why search for the writings of people who are both stupid and liars? But what if the critical mistake is in the one making accusations?

December 5, 2014January 19, 2015

Attacks From a Ropen in New Mexico?

apparently desert scene in Chaves County, New Mexico

A speculation can fail, under scrutiny, but when human lives are in danger we need action. I’ve recently been reading the nonfiction Missing 411 – Western United States & Canada, by the former lawman David Paulides. On page 200, the author points out that all six of those missing persons listed in New Mexico disappeared in the Santa Fe National Forest. Why did none of them go missing in any other national forest of New Mexico? We have four other national forests in that state, plus three national grasslands (and two other managed areas, designated wildlife or wilderness).

Some kind of predator was probably involved in at least two of those cases, someone or something dangerous residing in that part of New Mexico. This may get complicated.

Before getting into details in those strange happenings in the southwestern United States we need to consider this: When all the experts’ explanations fail, consider the idea that fits many of the facts but runs contrary to a cultural assumption of those experts. Some of those strange happenings are probably unknown to those who were involved in the search and rescue efforts, namely observations of large long-tailed flying creatures in New Mexico. Now remember Sherlock Holmes: “When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth.”

I’d be surprised if Mr. Paulides had read my book Live Pterosaurs in America, for it’s not close to a national nonfiction best-seller. Few search and rescue professionals or amateurs, if any, are likely to have known, during their searching, about the investigations my associates and I have conducted over many years. Those trying to make sense of those missing persons in New Mexico could have been completely ignorant of attacks from large flying creatures in Mexico and in British Columbia, Canada. Yet why should Americans be immune to similar attacks in wilderness areas of the United States?

I applaud the work of search and rescue persons and investigators who have done all that could have been expected of them. Sometimes they find somebody or find a satisfactory reason for a disappearance; sometimes not. We now need to apply what we have learned about ropens in North America.

“Dragons” near Magdalena Mountains, New Mexico

The following I included in the third edition of Live Pterosaurs in America:

“Fourteen years ago [1993, in Socorro, New Mexico], me and a close friend, who now has a masters in biology, were hiking during the midday sun at [a] box canyon and something blocked the sun for a moment. We both looked up to see what did that and saw a large flying animal. It had a 20-30 foot wingspan and was about the same length long. It had a long tail with [a] seeming spike at the end. Its head was very pterodactyl shape with a fluted back pointy head. . . . we watched it glide . . . and land somewhere on the southern expanse of Magdalena Mountains.”

The man who told me about his sighting (above) mentioned the word dragon.

Details on those missing

Of the six persons who were missing in one area of New Mexico, three of them were children, in age from three to seven, in June of 1951. Those three kids were lost together and found together, all alive. The other three persons were adults who were never found, and they disappeared in 1982, 1998, and 2009. The following comparisons suggest there is no cause-relationship between the children and the adults:

Found alive or never found
Mid-20th century or 1982-2009
Group or lone individual
Children or adults

As I see it, the strange disappearances in one wilderness area of New Mexico resolve into three critical cases, three adults who went missing from 1982 to 2009. Searchers and experts found those three cases baffling. According to Mr. Paulides, “The New Mexico State Police investigator who has the Emma Tresp [who went missing in 1998] case made this statement: ‘It’s like she vanished off the face of the earth.'”

Bigfoot complication, or not

Mr. Paulides mentions the case of the man who went missing in September of 2009; that’s too recent for me to mention the name here. On page 195 of the Missing-411 book it says that the tracking dogs followed the man’s scent for 150 years and then stopped. Some followers of Bigfoot investigations have suggested that dogs might be afraid when they encounter the smell of a Bigfoot, causing them to avoid that kind of trail. That too is speculative. I suggest the dogs that lose the scent suddenly, in some of these missing persons cases in wilderness areas of North America in general, have stopped their tracking where the child or adult was carried into the air.

Carried away by a giant pterodactyl? What could be more unbelievable? Well, what about being carried away by a Bigfoot? The logic of Sherlock Holmes says it was either a Bigfoot or a dragon; take your choice.

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Eyewitnesses of ropen interviewed

Three men describe the pterodactyl-like creature of Umboi Island, Papua New Guinea. They saw the giant ropen (about 1994) flying over Lake Pung.

Glowing Ropen in New Mexico

The moon had already gone behind the trees, by the middle of that night a week ago Monday, so Mr. Slack and his buddy searched the sky for the Andromeda Nebula. This required using a low-magnification eyepiece, fortunately, to locate that galaxy, allowing the amateur astronomer to see the flying creature sweep through the field of view.

Attacks From Pterodactyls?

One of the American ropen-cryptozoologists, Jonathan Whitcomb, has now suggested that some of the strange missing-persons cases from wilderness areas of the United States may be from attacks from a few ropens.

Author Jonathan Whitcomb

[He] has interviewed eyewitnesses since 2004, common people who have seen, worldwide, uncommon flying creatures.

Modern-pterosaur book: Searching for Ropens and Finding God, by J. D. Whitcomb

From the back cover of this 360-page paperback:

Settle into a comfortable chair and prepare for what may become the most unsettling scientific discovery since Copernicus and Galileo. This true story takes you into the expeditions that began to prepare the Western world for a discovery not yet recognized by scientists in developed countries.